INFO-VAX Wed, 25 Jun 2008 Volume 2008 : Issue 352
Contents:
Re: Book "OpenVMS for Unix Users"
Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Re: How to transfer complete disk images without using tape
Re: How to transfer complete disk images without using tape
Re: How to transfer complete disk images without using tape
Re: LMF and abandonned products
Re: LMF and abandonned products
Re: LMF and abandonned products
Re: Network gear pricing
Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system
Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
Re: OT: Network gear pricing
Re: Tru64 file system source code now open source
Re: Tru64 file system source code now open source
Re: Virtualized VMS in clusters (general questions)
Re: Virtualized VMS in clusters (general questions)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 13:51:54 -0400
From: "John Smith" <John.Smith@NotTheOneAtHP.com>
Subject: Re: Book "OpenVMS for Unix Users"
Message-ID: <9c096$4861343d$4c0aab67$11372@TEKSAVVY.COM>
It seems that Elsevier press bought the assets of Digital Press.
You might want to contact them and see if they have any ability to
'print-on-demand'. Some publishers are now doing this with low-volume items.
"Ralf Folkerts" <ralffmail-news2@yahoo.de> wrote in message
news:2js4j5-mf1.ln1@boss.home.folkerts-net.de...
> Hi,
>
> while searching for Books that might help me getting into OpenVMS I found
> the abovementioned Book "OpenVMS for Unix Users" (ISBN: 1555583253) from
> Digital Press.
>
> However, I was unable to locate a Copy or find a Review. I searched
> Alibris and the Sites mentioned in the OpenVMS-FAQ (inkl. elsevier)
> amongst googling for it.
>
> Does anyone have a hint where that book might be available? Or could
> anyone either recommend or disadvice that Book? I have been using Unix
> (and FreeBSD and Linux) for many years now, so I hope that this book might
> help me getting onto track faster...
>
> Cheers,
> _ralf_
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 18:15:41 GMT
From: VMS is Virus Free <vms@virusfree.org>
Subject: Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Message-ID: <mfd264lag0kjct8ushubomf4s9vppt3qc8@4ax.com>
On 23 Jun 2008 21:32:14 -0400, Rich Alderson
<news@alderson.users.panix.com> wrote:
>VMS is Virus Free <vms@virusfree.org> writes:
>
>> I had run across a gem of a book about how to do technical writing
>> when I was working at Digital back in the 80s. It was a wonderful book
>> by John O'Rourke entitled "Writing for the Reader". It, more than any
>> other book before or since, changed the way I viewed writing.
>
>No such title by such an author is listed in the Library of Congress, nor does
>the title appear by any other writer. The closest the LoC (or ABEbooks, for
>that matter) comes is Mary Lynch's _Writing in the Disciplines: A Reader_.
>
>I wonder if it might have been a DEC-internal publication.
It may have been internal to Digital but I could have swore it had
greater distribution than that. I have tried used book stores, hard to
find books, etc., all to no avail.
Here are a couple of URLs that really attest to the fact that it was
real:
http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=323287.323318 - see reference
ORO76
Also, Amazon seems to know about it but does say that it's out of
print (duh):
http://www.amazon.com/Writing-reader-John-ORourke/dp/B0006WL9GQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1214330988&sr=8-1
And here's an excerpt from the preface of the book that pretty much
set the tone for the remainder of this work:
http://blogsarestupid.com/day44.html
If you haven't read this excerpt before, it's more than worth the few
minutes it'll take you.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 16:24:35 -0400
From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Message-ID: <7JudnRA6t7UNxfzVnZ2dnUVZ_i2dnZ2d@comcast.com>
VMS is Virus Free wrote:
> On 23 Jun 2008 21:32:14 -0400, Rich Alderson
> <news@alderson.users.panix.com> wrote:
>
>> VMS is Virus Free <vms@virusfree.org> writes:
>>
>>> I had run across a gem of a book about how to do technical writing
>>> when I was working at Digital back in the 80s. It was a wonderful book
>>> by John O'Rourke entitled "Writing for the Reader". It, more than any
>>> other book before or since, changed the way I viewed writing.
>> No such title by such an author is listed in the Library of Congress, nor does
>> the title appear by any other writer. The closest the LoC (or ABEbooks, for
>> that matter) comes is Mary Lynch's _Writing in the Disciplines: A Reader_.
>>
>> I wonder if it might have been a DEC-internal publication.
>
> It may have been internal to Digital but I could have swore it had
> greater distribution than that. I have tried used book stores, hard to
> find books, etc., all to no avail.
>
> Here are a couple of URLs that really attest to the fact that it was
> real:
>
> http://portal.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=323287.323318 - see reference
> ORO76
>
> Also, Amazon seems to know about it but does say that it's out of
> print (duh):
>
> http://www.amazon.com/Writing-reader-John-ORourke/dp/B0006WL9GQ/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1214330988&sr=8-1
>
> And here's an excerpt from the preface of the book that pretty much
> set the tone for the remainder of this work:
>
> http://blogsarestupid.com/day44.html
>
> If you haven't read this excerpt before, it's more than worth the few
> minutes it'll take you.
That's a real oldie but it makes a good point; screw the polysyllabic
circumlocution and just smack them upside the head!
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:56:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: LakeGator <LakeGator@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Message-ID: <23ac19d8-f291-48d5-b836-09fc3d6c29b1@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>
On Jun 23, 9:03=A0pm, VMS is Virus Free <v...@virusfree.org> wrote:
> I had run across a gem of a book about how to do technical writing
> when I was working at Digital back in the 80s. It was a wonderful book
> by John O'Rourke entitle "Writing for the Reader". It, more than any
> other book before or since, changed the way I viewed writing.
>
> Alas, over the years, time has managed to hide that book so well that
> I no longer can find it. I have tried every source that I know of yet
> there doesn't seem to be a copy anywhere. I even asked the publisher
> if there was a PDF version I could buy but to no avail.
>
> If any of you has a spare copy of the gem that you'd be willing to
> part with, I'd be more than willing to pay for it or find some way of
> compensating you. If anyone can help, I'll put up a real Email address
> so that we can take this offline.
>
> Thx.
I loved the book and still have a copy. I would be happy to work out
some way to share it with you. The copyright is 1976 and I assume
that making a copy at this point is mostly legal. Given the size and
form factor of the book making a copy will be a pain
It certainly was created by Runoff given the structure and numbering
used in the book. It would be great if the source files had been
preserved, somehow. I have no idea whether scanning the pages would
work.
I rarely use my Gmail email as it is 99.78% spam but I will look for
an email about this great little book.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 01:31:32 GMT
From: VMS is Virus Free <vms@virusfree.org>
Subject: Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Message-ID: <7u7364t1j3hdg81ae1pgd97df77upk69l0@4ax.com>
On Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:56:29 -0700 (PDT), LakeGator
<LakeGator@gmail.com> wrote:
>I loved the book and still have a copy. I would be happy to work out
>some way to share it with you. The copyright is 1976 and I assume
>that making a copy at this point is mostly legal. Given the size and
>form factor of the book making a copy will be a pain
>
>It certainly was created by Runoff given the structure and numbering
>used in the book. It would be great if the source files had been
>preserved, somehow. I have no idea whether scanning the pages would
>work.
>
>I rarely use my Gmail email as it is 99.78% spam but I will look for
>an email about this great little book.
Email sent.
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 00:13:03 -0400
From: "John Smith" <John.Smith@NotTheOneAtHP.com>
Subject: Re: Book: "Writing for the Reader" by John O'Rourke
Message-ID: <85e5$4861c4da$4c0aab67$960@TEKSAVVY.COM>
If you have a PC or Mac, the Fujitsu ScanSnap S500 or S510 does fantastic
job of double-sided scanning and OCR to .pdf at up to 18 pages/minute.
Resulting .pdf is fully searchable. Runs about $350 with a full Adobe
Acrobat license & OCR software.
I'm currently scanning old reports I wrote originally on dedicated Wang word
processing machine - still have the 8" floppies but nothing to read them on,
so scanning is the answer.
It even does scanning of tabular data (printed in 6-7 pt. type) into Excel
with perfect accuracy if the scan speed is reduced to about 6 ppm.
Highly recommended.
"LakeGator" <LakeGator@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:23ac19d8-f291-48d5-b836-09fc3d6c29b1@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
On Jun 23, 9:03 pm, VMS is Virus Free <v...@virusfree.org> wrote:
> I had run across a gem of a book about how to do technical writing
> when I was working at Digital back in the 80s. It was a wonderful book
> by John O'Rourke entitle "Writing for the Reader". It, more than any
> other book before or since, changed the way I viewed writing.
>
> Alas, over the years, time has managed to hide that book so well that
> I no longer can find it. I have tried every source that I know of yet
> there doesn't seem to be a copy anywhere. I even asked the publisher
> if there was a PDF version I could buy but to no avail.
>
> If any of you has a spare copy of the gem that you'd be willing to
> part with, I'd be more than willing to pay for it or find some way of
> compensating you. If anyone can help, I'll put up a real Email address
> so that we can take this offline.
>
> Thx.
I loved the book and still have a copy. I would be happy to work out
some way to share it with you. The copyright is 1976 and I assume
that making a copy at this point is mostly legal. Given the size and
form factor of the book making a copy will be a pain
It certainly was created by Runoff given the structure and numbering
used in the book. It would be great if the source files had been
preserved, somehow. I have no idea whether scanning the pages would
work.
I rarely use my Gmail email as it is 99.78% spam but I will look for
an email about this great little book.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 18:46:05 +0000 (UTC)
From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney)
Subject: Re: How to transfer complete disk images without using tape
Message-ID: <g3rfdd$bgp$1@pcls6.std.com>
I'll add my "me too" and state I agree that clustering the systems
temporarily is the best way, with BACKUP over DECnet the second best
choice. You could BACKUP to a local scratch drive, ftp the backup save
set, fix the save set on the new system and restore it if you had to.
If you use clustering, BACKUP can clone a device in one step since it's
all "local". Using DECnet requires two steps, backing up to a save set on
the new system and restoring the save set to a new drive. You may have to
dedicate a spare drive to the saveset and/or do the disks one at a time,
depending on the size of the drives involved and how full they are.
FTP of the saveset requires multiple steps as well as temporary space on
both systems.
Will the files be "live" when you want to do this? You'll have to figure
out what to do with files open when you do the backup, since either
BACKUP will skip them or (if you specify /IGNORE=INTERLOCK) there's a risk
the file won't be copied consistently. If you mount the source drive
privately and don't open files, this shouldn't be an issue.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 16:02:29 -0400
From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca>
Subject: Re: How to transfer complete disk images without using tape
Message-ID: <486152de$0$22481$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>
Richard B. Gilbert wrote:
> If you are located somewhere near Philadelphia, I could hold your hand
> for a not too outrageous fee.
Wow ! Didn't think C.O.V. would degrade down to having escort service
ads :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 15:08:10 -0600
From: Jim Mehlhop <Mehlhop.remove@this.parsec.com>
Subject: Re: How to transfer complete disk images without using tape
Message-ID: <4861623A.7010803@this.parsec.com>
I was stuck doing the backup to savesets on another system this last
week where one system (the source) was compute bound and had a 10 Mb
Ethernet. Moving about 50 GB took almost 10 hours.
The machines were in 2 different segments with a router that would not
route SCS protocol (thus no cluster) Wish now that I had forced them to
bridge SCS and do the cluster/shadow thing, but they didn't have a
Volume Shadowing license either. :-(
Best solution is definitely high speed ethernet (Gigabit prefered)
clustered and running Volume shadowing, so there is no downtime on the data.
Michael Moroney wrote:
> I'll add my "me too" and state I agree that clustering the systems
> temporarily is the best way, with BACKUP over DECnet the second best
> choice. You could BACKUP to a local scratch drive, ftp the backup save
> set, fix the save set on the new system and restore it if you had to.
>
> If you use clustering, BACKUP can clone a device in one step since it's
> all "local". Using DECnet requires two steps, backing up to a save set on
> the new system and restoring the save set to a new drive. You may have to
> dedicate a spare drive to the saveset and/or do the disks one at a time,
> depending on the size of the drives involved and how full they are.
> FTP of the saveset requires multiple steps as well as temporary space on
> both systems.
>
> Will the files be "live" when you want to do this? You'll have to figure
> out what to do with files open when you do the backup, since either
> BACKUP will skip them or (if you specify /IGNORE=INTERLOCK) there's a risk
> the file won't be copied consistently. If you mount the source drive
> privately and don't open files, this shouldn't be an issue.
>
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 15:57:32 -0400
From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca>
Subject: Re: LMF and abandonned products
Message-ID: <486151b6$0$22481$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>
VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
> (c) ANONYMOUS WORKS, PSEUDONYMOUS WORKS, AND WORKS MADE FOR HIRE. -- In the
> case of an anonymous work, a pseudonymous work, or a work made for hire, the
> copyright endures for a term of 95 years from the year of its first publica-
> tion, or a term of 120 years from the year of its creation, whichever expires
> first. {...}
Ok, silly question here:
It is clear that IBM couldn't steal VMS code and integrate it into MVS.
However, if a licence is forged and someone uses the software without
paying for it, isn't this just theft instead of copyright infringement ?
If this is theft, isn't the test whether you are depriving someone of
revenue or a possession ?
------------------------------
Date: 24 Jun 2008 23:05:08 GMT
From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG
Subject: Re: LMF and abandonned products
Message-ID: <48617da4$0$7357$607ed4bc@cv.net>
In article <486151b6$0$22481$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> writes:
>VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
>
>> (c) ANONYMOUS WORKS, PSEUDONYMOUS WORKS, AND WORKS MADE FOR HIRE. -- In the
>> case of an anonymous work, a pseudonymous work, or a work made for hire, the
>> copyright endures for a term of 95 years from the year of its first publica-
>> tion, or a term of 120 years from the year of its creation, whichever expires
>> first. {...}
>
>Ok, silly question here:
>
>It is clear that IBM couldn't steal VMS code and integrate it into MVS.
>
>
>However, if a licence is forged and someone uses the software without
>paying for it, isn't this just theft instead of copyright infringement ?
>
>If this is theft, isn't the test whether you are depriving someone of
>revenue or a possession ?
Semantics, JF.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM
"Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"
http://tmesis.com/drat.html
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 16:19:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rich Jordan <jordan@ccs4vms.com>
Subject: Re: LMF and abandonned products
Message-ID: <60f17c15-efd9-4391-b70b-5fa1f18e53ec@r66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>
On Jun 24, 2:57=A0pm, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spam...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:
> > (c) ANONYMOUS WORKS, PSEUDONYMOUS WORKS, AND WORKS MADE FOR HIRE. -- In=
the
> > case of an anonymous work, a pseudonymous work, or a work made for hire=
, the
> > copyright endures for a term of 95 years from the year of its first pub=
lica-
> > tion, or a term of 120 years from the year of its creation, whichever e=
xpires
> > first. =A0{...}
>
> Ok, silly question here:
>
> It is clear that IBM couldn't steal VMS code and integrate it into MVS.
>
> However, if a licence is forged and someone uses the software without
> paying for it, isn't this just theft instead of copyright infringement ?
>
> If this is theft, isn't the test whether you are depriving someone of
> revenue or a possession ?
I think they settled that (and not for the first time I'd bet) with
home computer software in the past. Out of print/publication programs
being circulated certainly didn't deprive the owners of revenue or
possession, but I do remember reading about some cases (20+ years ago)
about the owners successfully suing on copyright basis.
Sorry, no links. If I had time to dig out all my old Byte and
Creative Computing magazines I'd bet I could find references.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:48:38 -0400
From: "David" <dturner@islandco.com>
Subject: Re: Network gear pricing
Message-ID: <bjb8k.10111$AJ6.7838@bignews8.bellsouth.net>
Ellacoya Product
E30-64-ac (A/C Power for 64K with 64K subscriber license subscriber)
$61,400
E30-64-dc (DC Power for 64K with 64K Subscriber license Subscriber) $61,300
Availabilty 2 weeks
Regards
--
David B Turner
=============================================
Island Computers US Corp
PO Box 86
Tybee GA 31328
Toll Free: 1-877 636 4332 x201, Mobile x251
Email: dturner@islandco.com
International & Local: (001)- 404-806-7749
Fax: 912 786 8505
Web: www.islandco.com
=============================================
"John Smith" <John.Smith@NotTheOneAtHP.com> wrote in message
news:df6ce$486132e7$4c0aab67$11203@TEKSAVVY.COM...
>
> Does anyone here know ballpark pricing for these traffic shaping devices?
>
> Arbor Ellacoya e30:
> Support up to 64,000 subscribers at 4 Gbps speed.
>
> Arbor Ellacoya e100:
> Support up to 500,000 subscribers at 20 Gbps speed
>
> Thanks.
>
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 15:07:05 -0700 (PDT)
From: Bob Gezelter <gezelter@rlgsc.com>
Subject: Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
Message-ID: <de54a372-1745-43ae-8acb-854eeb91af3d@x35g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>
On Jun 24, 5:37 pm, Rich Jordan <jor...@ccs4vms.com> wrote:
> I need to have the ability for a PCSI install command procedure to
> optionally add a record to a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT file in a user
> directory on a customer system. This is likely going to include
> systems that we do not have access too (hence the reason we're
> packaging as a PCSI file; previous installs have been hands on and
> custom).
>
> Some possibilities are easy; if the file doesn't exist, create it
> (actually copy a default file with the required entries). If it
> exists but doesn't contain the records needed, append a stub with the
> records.
>
> If it exists and one or more of the records I need are already there,
> I can't necessarily count on them being the "way" I need them without
> parsing individual lines in the file. If one or more needed records
> is present but "incorrect" (by my application's opinion) then I've got
> a manual intervention requirement; the system manager has to
> straighten things up.
>
> Is there a 'best practices' way to deal with situations like this on a
> random, non-accessible system within the purview of the PCSI product
> installer?
>
> Thanks
>
> Rich
Rich,
Having written several PCSI scripts, I recommend a thorough reading of
the Polycenter Install Guide. PCSI has the ability to call command
procedures at various points, and most of the limits are very broad.
- Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 16:16:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rich Jordan <jordan@ccs4vms.com>
Subject: Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
Message-ID: <5b7465cb-292c-4807-b727-f8550cf087e3@x41g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>
On Jun 24, 5:07=A0pm, Bob Gezelter <gezel...@rlgsc.com> wrote:
> On Jun 24, 5:37 pm, Rich Jordan <jor...@ccs4vms.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I need to have the ability for a PCSI install command procedure to
> > optionally add a record to a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT file in a user
> > directory on a customer system. =A0This is likely going to include
> > systems that we do not have access too (hence the reason we're
> > packaging as a PCSI file; previous installs have been hands on and
> > custom).
>
> > Some possibilities are easy; if the file doesn't exist, create it
> > (actually copy a default file with the required entries). =A0If it
> > exists but doesn't contain the records needed, append a stub with the
> > records.
>
> > If it exists and one or more of the records I need are already there,
> > I can't necessarily count on them being the "way" I need them without
> > parsing individual lines in the file. =A0If one or more needed records
> > is present but "incorrect" (by my application's opinion) then I've got
> > a manual intervention requirement; the system manager has to
> > straighten things up.
>
> > Is there a 'best practices' way to deal with situations like this on a
> > random, non-accessible system within the purview of the PCSI product
> > installer?
>
> > Thanks
>
> > Rich
>
> Rich,
>
> Having written several PCSI scripts, I recommend a thorough reading of
> the Polycenter Install Guide. PCSI has the ability to call command
> procedures at various points, and most of the limits are very broad.
>
> - Bob Gezelter,http://www.rlgsc.com
Bob,
thanks, I have been working from the manual and do have a
reasonable understanding of the technical aspects. I've also been
dissecting some other install command procedures which were pretty
helpful. I'm just running into more and more little 'issues' with
this since the PCSI kit is going in cold to an unknown system. I'm
trying to be as careful and finicky as possible about touching
anything outside of the actual application directories. And the more
I look at it and think about it (and play with test systems) it seems
like the more finicky and extra careful I have to be.
I know how to do what I need to do in this case; its more a
question of how much effort needs to be expended (probably a lot) and
how much is "OK" to leave to a system manager to take care of. In
this case, do I have to allow for the fact that this one account might
already have a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT file that might already have records
for the filetypes I need, and that one or more of those may be
incompatible with my needs.
Its highly unlikely; the filetypes records are pretty much
verbatim out of Netscape/Mozilla browser definitions, and I believe
pretty much the same elsewhere, but just my luck someone installs this
then starts venting at us (me!) because it caused j-random other app
that requires a _different_ custom mime filetype record for a
particular file type in the same account that just won't work with
ours, and OBTW we just blew up a week worth of production ;)
We of course leave inserting startup procedure calls into the
system startup to the system manager; perhaps its not too out of place
to assume the same for this if there's already a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT
file in place. Leave it to the installer to deal with the conflict
(which would be a significant problem...)
I also need to check for and avoid (or defer to the installer)
conflicts in startup file name (it its to be in SYS$STARTUP; I could
just leave it in the application directory but I prefer it be in the
central location) as well as other system resources. The install
procedure (the install PART of the install/remove procedure) is
currently at 900 lines of DCL (not counting comments) as I check, and
recheck, and double check all the possible permutations of changes
that I can think of that might be different on a customer box that we
don't have access to.
Thanks!
Rich
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 16:16:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rich Jordan <jordan@ccs4vms.com>
Subject: Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
Message-ID: <83b0b37a-1572-4e9c-9cc5-908b9845b869@x35g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>
On Jun 24, 5:22=A0pm, Jan-Erik S=F6derholm <jan-erik.soderh...@telia.com>
wrote:
> Bob Gezelter wrote:
> > On Jun 24, 5:37 pm, Rich Jordan <jor...@ccs4vms.com> wrote:
> >> I need to have the ability for a PCSI install command procedure to
> >> optionally add a record to a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT file in a user
> >> directory on a customer system. =A0This is likely going to include
> >> systems that we do not have access too (hence the reason we're
> >> packaging as a PCSI file; previous installs have been hands on and
> >> custom).
>
> >> Some possibilities are easy; if the file doesn't exist, create it
> >> (actually copy a default file with the required entries). =A0If it
> >> exists but doesn't contain the records needed, append a stub with the
> >> records.
>
> >> If it exists and one or more of the records I need are already there,
> >> I can't necessarily count on them being the "way" I need them without
> >> parsing individual lines in the file. =A0If one or more needed records
> >> is present but "incorrect" (by my application's opinion) then I've got
> >> a manual intervention requirement; the system manager has to
> >> straighten things up.
>
> >> Is there a 'best practices' way to deal with situations like this on a
> >> random, non-accessible system within the purview of the PCSI product
> >> installer?
>
> >> Thanks
>
> >> Rich
>
> > Rich,
>
> > Having written several PCSI scripts, I recommend a thorough reading of
> > the Polycenter Install Guide. PCSI has the ability to call command
> > procedures at various points, and most of the limits are very broad.
>
> > - Bob Gezelter,http://www.rlgsc.com
>
> I guess one could just *document* the needed changes/additons
> to MIME$FILETYPES.DAT and let the sysadmin take care of it.
>
> Jan-Erik.
A tempting option, and currently the default for any situation where
there is already a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT file in place.
Rich
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:37:50 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rich Jordan <jordan@ccs4vms.com>
Subject: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system
Message-ID: <2ec84886-faf1-4f75-9405-6e6c8f06943a@t54g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>
I need to have the ability for a PCSI install command procedure to
optionally add a record to a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT file in a user
directory on a customer system. This is likely going to include
systems that we do not have access too (hence the reason we're
packaging as a PCSI file; previous installs have been hands on and
custom).
Some possibilities are easy; if the file doesn't exist, create it
(actually copy a default file with the required entries). If it
exists but doesn't contain the records needed, append a stub with the
records.
If it exists and one or more of the records I need are already there,
I can't necessarily count on them being the "way" I need them without
parsing individual lines in the file. If one or more needed records
is present but "incorrect" (by my application's opinion) then I've got
a manual intervention requirement; the system manager has to
straighten things up.
Is there a 'best practices' way to deal with situations like this on a
random, non-accessible system within the purview of the PCSI product
installer?
Thanks
Rich
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 22:22:11 GMT
From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jan-Erik_S=F6derholm?=
Subject: Re: On the fly PCSI install needs to update text file on target system systemsys
Message-ID: <nse8k.504$U5.560@newsb.telia.net>
Bob Gezelter wrote:
> On Jun 24, 5:37 pm, Rich Jordan <jor...@ccs4vms.com> wrote:
>> I need to have the ability for a PCSI install command procedure to
>> optionally add a record to a MIME$FILETYPES.DAT file in a user
>> directory on a customer system. This is likely going to include
>> systems that we do not have access too (hence the reason we're
>> packaging as a PCSI file; previous installs have been hands on and
>> custom).
>>
>> Some possibilities are easy; if the file doesn't exist, create it
>> (actually copy a default file with the required entries). If it
>> exists but doesn't contain the records needed, append a stub with the
>> records.
>>
>> If it exists and one or more of the records I need are already there,
>> I can't necessarily count on them being the "way" I need them without
>> parsing individual lines in the file. If one or more needed records
>> is present but "incorrect" (by my application's opinion) then I've got
>> a manual intervention requirement; the system manager has to
>> straighten things up.
>>
>> Is there a 'best practices' way to deal with situations like this on a
>> random, non-accessible system within the purview of the PCSI product
>> installer?
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Rich
>
> Rich,
>
> Having written several PCSI scripts, I recommend a thorough reading of
> the Polycenter Install Guide. PCSI has the ability to call command
> procedures at various points, and most of the limits are very broad.
>
> - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com
I guess one could just *document* the needed changes/additons
to MIME$FILETYPES.DAT and let the sysadmin take care of it.
Jan-Erik.
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 16:08:29 -0400
From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca>
Subject: Re: OT: Network gear pricing
Message-ID: <48615449$0$23858$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>
John Smith wrote:
> Does anyone here know ballpark pricing for these traffic shaping devices?
>
> Arbor Ellacoya e30:
> Support up to 64,000 subscribers at 4 Gbps speed.
>
> Arbor Ellacoya e100:
> Support up to 500,000 subscribers at 20 Gbps speed
Only people without ethics, morals and out to screw their customers and
steal their private data would want to buy such devices. And there are
no such people here on c.o.v.
But I am sure HP would be perfectly happy to buy those satanic boxes.
Since Bell has their boxes next to each BAS, the roughly 2 million DSL
subscribers divided by about 250 BAS machines makes it about 8000
subscribers per BAS, so the E30 is more than capable of handling that
load. And remember that BCE invested some 35 million into Ellacoya,
probably funding the development of the ability to handle L2TP traffic
which contains PPPoE which contain PPP which contain IP which contains
TCP which contains data. (Bell is not supposed to see anything beyond
the PPPoE header).
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 15:51:11 -0400
From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca>
Subject: Re: Tru64 file system source code now open source
Message-ID: <48615038$0$23890$c3e8da3@news.astraweb.com>
John Smith wrote:
> http://www.informationweek.com/news/software/open_source/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=208800252
>
>
>
##
Tru64 is a 64-bit Unix operating system for the Alpha microprocessor
architecture owned by HP. Tru64 was a product of Compaq, which was
acquired by HP in 2002.
##
No mention of Tru64 coming from Digital. No mention about Alpha having
been murdered and Tru64 development having stopped in 2001.
The last paragraph though is the best. Finally, a true reflection of
HP's true intentions. And I bet The Stallards/Livermores of HP will
applaud that paragraph instead of writing a letter to informationweek to
deny it. (someone else already posted that paragraphs about HP migrating
apps from VMS/Tru64 to HP-UX).
This is the official HP press release about it: (Note that HP developped
Tru64).
##
HP Contributes Source Code to Open Source Community to Advance Adoption
of Linux
MainSMDS
PALO ALTO, Calif.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--June 23, 2008--
Continuing its efforts to advance customer adoption of Linux, HP
(NYSE:HPQ)today announced the contribution of its Tru64 UNIX Advanced
File System (AdvFS)source code to the open source community.
The AdvFS source code includes capabilities that increase uptime,
enhancesecurity and help ensure maximum performance of Linux file
systems. HP willcontribute the code as a reference implementation of an
enterprise Linux filesystem under the terms of General Public License
Version 2 for compatibilitywith the Linux kernel, as well as provide
design documentation, test suites andengineering resources.
Linux is one of the most prominent examples of free software and open
sourcedevelopment, and source code continues to draw interest from
developers, theuser community and customers. HP, which ships a Linux
server at the rate of oneper minute, has long provided open source
alternatives to customers andcontributed to the open source community to
speed market development.
The source code serves as a rich technology base to advance
ongoingdevelopment of Linux by providing a comprehensive foundation for
Linux kerneldevelopers to leverage and improve Linux file system
functionality.
Developed by HP, AdvFS has been deployed for more than 16 years by
enterprisesthroughout the world. It simplifies file and storage
management, enables onlinesystem backups and increases data
availability. The integration of key AdvFSfile system features also
accelerates the roadmap of future solutions designedto strengthen Linux
for enterprise customers.
"To ensure the highest levels of data security and availability,
Linuxcustomers need full and immediate access to established
technology," said MartinFink, senior vice president and general manager,
Business Critical Systems, HP."We continue to invest our engineering
resources in the development of thattechnology, while working with the
open source community to ensure accessibilityand seamless integration."
Increasing Linux performance and advancing productivity
Business demands for improved solutions are driving the Linux
kerneldevelopment community to focus on the advancement of file system
functionality.Currently, file systems are being developed through an
open community process.HP's contribution fuels these efforts.
"HP's contribution of the Advanced File System code, coupled with
theiroverall resource commitment to Linux, will greatly accelerate the
developmentand commercial availability of improved system functionality
for Linux," saidJim Zemlin, executive director, Linux Foundation. "The
technology andengineering resources being made available for
next-generation file systemprojects are proof that HP is a true open
source community leader."
Linux market leader
HP extended its worldwide lead in the Linux market with 38.6 percent
ofrevenue market share for the first quarter of 2008, according to IDC.
HP alsoholds the No. 1 Linux server market position in unit shipments,
with 36.4percent of market share worldwide.(1)
"HP's contribution accelerates the development of future Linux file
systems,ensuring enhanced system performance to meet our increasingly
demanding needs,"said Professor Giovanni Aloisio, chief executive
officer of the Italian SouthernPartnership for Advance Computational
Infrastructures (SPACI) in southern Italy."Linux is playing a
significant role in our building of a supercomputing gridenvironment
running HP Integrity servers. We have used many technologies overthe
years, including Tru64 UNIX with the Advanced File System, and
thisannouncement assures SPACI of continued Linux growth to conduct
significant newresearch."
The Tru64 UNIX Advanced File System source code, design documentation
and testsuites are available by visiting http://advfs.sourceforge.net.
More informationon open source and Linux at HP is available at
www.hp.com/go/linux.
About HP
HP focuses on simplifying technology experiences for all of its
customers -from individual consumers to the largest businesses. With a
portfolio that spansprinting, personal computing, software, services and
IT infrastructure, HP isamong the world's largest IT companies, with
revenue totaling $110.4 billion forthe four fiscal quarters ended April
30, 2008. More information about HP isavailable at www.hp.com.
Note to editors: More news from HP, including links to RSS feeds, is
availableat www.hp.com/hpinfo/newsroom/.
(1) IDC Worldwide Quarterly Server Tracker, May 2008.
This news release contains forward-looking statements that involve
risks,uncertainties and assumptions <lots of legal mumble jumble removed
to save bandwidth> ... warranty. HPshall not be liable for technical or
editorial errors or omissionscontained herein. CONTACT: HP
Dayna Fried, +1-949-240-2119 dayna.fried@hp.com
or Burson-Marsteller for HP Ali Kops,
+1-312-596-3428 ali.kops@bm.com or
HP Media Hotline, +1-866-266-7272 pr@hp.com
www.hp.com/go/newsroom SOURCE: HPCopyright Business Wire 2008
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 00:02:21 GMT
From: Bob Harris <nospam.News.Bob@remove.Smith-Harris.us>
Subject: Re: Tru64 file system source code now open source
Message-ID: <nospam.News.Bob-1BE3D3.20021824062008@news.verizon.net>
In article
<OF3F0D0A85.38F57CDC-ON85257472.0042B5E4-85257472.0042F2AD@metso.c
om>,
norm.raphael@metso.com wrote:
> "John Smith" <John.Smith@NotTheOneAtHP.com> wrote on 06/24/2008 07:52:01
> AM:
>
> > http://www.informationweek.
> > com/news/software/open_source/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=208800252
> >
> >
> >
>
> Isn't this statement a bit as from an alternate universe in another time:
>
> "Besides Tru64, HP also acquired the VMS platform in the Compaq purchase,
> and later proceeded to migrate third-party applications that ran on the
> two operating systems to HP-UX. Many users, however, chose to move to
> Linux from Tru64 instead."
There is only 1 tiny little problem with this statement.
Christmas 2004, HP laid-off *ALL* of the Tru64 UNIX developers
involved in porting those components to HP-UX. And as far as I
know, HP never released those ported products.
Bob Harris
Laid-off Christmas 2004 :-)
Started a new job 3 weeks later
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 00:34:21 +0300
From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Kari_Uusim=E4ki?=
Subject: Re: Virtualized VMS in clusters (general questions)
Message-ID: <48616860$0$14996$9b536df3@news.fv.fi>
Main, Kerry wrote:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing
>> [mailto:winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU]
>> Sent: June 21, 2008 5:19 PM
>> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com
>> Subject: Virtualized VMS in clusters (general questions)
>>
>> VMSers --
>>
>> I'm trying to wrap my head around how virtualized VMS systems
>> participate in
>> certain aspects of clustering and volume shadowing. There may be
>> something
>> I'm just not getting. So this is kind of general.
>>
>> At the HP Tech Forum I got to play with booting a virtual Itanium on a
>> real
>> Itanium blade (which ran HPVM which runs on HP/UX; my first HP/UX login
>> ever).
>> I've encountered, also, the SRI Alpha emulators, and seen the SimH VAX
>> emulator
>> running. (I was trying to ask the kind of question I'm asking here at
>> the
>> Wilm's very interesting session on the architecture of the Alpha
>> emulator, and
>> I made them sound like plain VMS questions, but they're really
>> questions about
>> the interaction of the emulated VMS node with the cluster, and I didn't
>> formulate them very well in person. I totally get that what the SRI
>> Alpha
>> emulator provides is an Alpha inside your Windows box, and that once
>> it's up,
>> VMS is VMS - or Tru-64 is Tru-64, or Linux is Linux, or whatever.)
>>
>
> Alan,
>
> My albeit somewhat biased point of view from a mission critical viewpoint
> (less important environments may have a different view):
>
> - Dev/QA environments should be as close to Prod as possible. Hence,
> Using virtual IO and computing environments for Dev/QA and real environ's
> for Prod is not a good strategy.
>
> - IT staffing is directly proportional to the number of OS instances, so
> the more VM environments, the more real work required to maintain, backup,
> monitor, license, the greater the staffing and licensing related costs.
>
> An example of what happens to most shops today - Cust starts with say 40
> servers, virtualizes to 40 instances on 10-15 servers using VMware. Great!
> Reduce HW, DC costs etc!! Of course, within a year, they are up to 70-80
> OS instances and all of a sudden they need to hire more staff .. so much
> for the cost savings.
>
> - Many vendors do not support their products in VM environments. If this
> is important, then this must be taken into consideration.
>
> - The reason why many OS's like Windows/Linux are loving the virtualized
> strategies is that traditionally and culturally they do not do business
> App stacking on the same OS instance, so virtualization is a good (albeit
> short term) strategy to reduce HW related server and DC costs which
> have gone out of control during the last 10 years - primarily based on
> the one bus App, one OS, one server model put in place. OpenVMS environ's
> do not have the cultural and/or technical challenges associated with App
> stacking on the same OS or even in the same cluster.
>
> - Moving forward, I would typically recommend a Itanium blade based
> Dev/QA OpenVMS environment and a blade or larger Itanium server
> environment for Prod environments. Need another Dev environment? Drop
> another blade in. At least with this approach, the IO and drivers
> would all be the same and you would reduce the potential for running
> into Prod issues when a particular prob was not found in Dev as it was
> using different drivers or issues related to the virtual environment.
>
> In summary, imho, the future will be about how to reduce work and OS
> instances and not about establishing more OS instances related to OS
> virtualization.
>
> [and btw, SAP now states that to support OS instance consolidation,
> Cust's should put the App servers on the same OS instance as the DB.]
>
> If I were in charge of a mission critical VMS environment, I would
> be looking at App stacking strategies using class schedulers, workload
> monitoring, mgmt and improved SLA reporting capabilities.
>
> Looking at virt environments and strategies would be a very low
> priority.
>
> :-)
>
>
> Regards
>
> Kerry Main
> Senior Consultant
> HP Services Canada
> Voice: 613-254-8911
> Fax: 613-591-4477
> kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom
> (remove the DOT's and AT)
>
> OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.
>
>
>
>
I do agree absolutely with Kerry!
I have a good example of real life consolidation from about ten years
ago when we used to run 300 different applications in one VAX/VMS
cluster with only three nodes (without performance problems!).
You can imagine how cost effective that was compared to running 300
virtual servers with one application per virtual machine.
Personally I would never run any production systems on virtual machines,
because you can never be sure of the stability and reliability of the
host system (unless it is OpenVMS). There are too many possible threats
to list here. Anybody can imagine most of them by himself.
The first and most important design condition of a production system is
platform intergrity, which means unthreatened stability, reliability and
security. Everything else comes second.
Kerry also mentioned why the IT costs has skyrocketed even though the
hardware and software prices has gone down. But what is behind that? The
answer is simple: the decision makers don't calculate the real costs of
IT systems and they never question the quality of cheap solutions.
Nowadays it is difficult to find well made software which works reliably
right out of the box - even for big money. It can really take years to
get an application to work like it should (now I don't mean freeware or
shareware applications, but commercial ones made by big software
companies). And what is most paradoxical is that many of these
malfunctioning applications are replacing a good and flawlessly working
application. What an incredible waste of money!
Why do you think there are still PDP's or VAXen (with VMS) running
critical production? Why aren't they replaced with PC's years ago?
In most cases nobody has been capable of producing a similar solution
which would be as good as or even better than the old one.
I know that many think that it is unnecessary to use e.g. an OpenVMS
workstation in the office instead of a PC. That depends, but it never is
an inferior solution. An cost effective solution for most office needs
would be to use graphical terminals (like X-terminals) on the desk and
to invest in better servers and software with good quality instead. The
immediate consequence would be less wasted money on software maintenance
costs (which means installations, troubleshooting, patching, malware
avoidance, etc) and the indirect consequence a significantly more
effective organisation.
Well, I guess nobody really cares about quality anymore. It is by far
easier to just drive prices up and make the average citizen to pay for
the insane wasting in one way or another.
Regards,
Kari
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 01:24:01 +0200
From: Johnny Billquist <bqt@update.uu.se>
Subject: Re: Virtualized VMS in clusters (general questions)
Message-ID: <g3rvm6$2jv$1@Tempo.Update.UU.SE>
Bob Koehler skrev:
> In article <00A7B8DF.3CD7C9DD@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>, winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing) writes:
>> So of course you're running nothing but Charon on the Windows box, and nothing
>> but Charon can do anything to the device. OK.
>>
>
> I wish the owners of Charon would put their emulator right on the
> hardware and get rid of the Windows layer.
>
> A bootable emulator, now that could solve some problems.
I believe you can more or less do that with E11, but that will limit you to
PDP-11 emulation...
Johnny
--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: bqt@softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
------------------------------
End of INFO-VAX 2008.352
************************