INFO-VAX Fri, 19 Oct 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 571 Contents: Re: Bigger isn't always better! Re: DEFRAG Re: Glass Fish on OpenVMS? Shafting Loyal Customers (again) Re: More scaremongering bollocks Re: Rare job posting Re: Rare job posting Re: Rare job posting Re: Rare job posting Re: Rare job posting Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Re: Which delete statement is faster? Re: Which delete statement is faster? Re: Which delete statement is faster? Re: Which delete statement is faster? Re: Which delete statement is faster? Re: www.hp.com/go/openvms is still toast Re: www.hp.com/go/openvms is still toast [OT-Funny] Does this remind you of anyone? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:49:22 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Bigger isn't always better! Message-ID: <47180d20$0$90271$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote: > In article <13h1olv48585h29@corp.supernews.com>, Mark Daniel writes: >> Excellent war-horse story. >> >> Haven't enjoyed such a good read on c.o.v. in a long time! >> >> Congratulations BTW. > > I second this (all three statements)! +1 Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 23:24:22 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: DEFRAG Message-ID: In article , Robert Deininger wrote: > In article <9hLRi.19192$UN.17317@newsfe24.lga>, > Ron Johnson wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > Is DFO really separately-purchased kit? > > I believe it is. It doesn't seem to be included in any of the Integrity > operating environment license bundles. I don't know if it's part of any > of the Alpha bundles. > > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/storage/dfopage.html DFO certainly used to be a separately purchasable item on VAX and Alpha, though may also have been incorporated into various software bundles. -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:44:58 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Glass Fish on OpenVMS? Shafting Loyal Customers (again) Message-ID: <47180c18$0$90271$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Richard Maher wrote: > How many people would be interested in running Glass Fish on OpenVMS, Alpha > or Integrity? > Of those, how many would want to: > > 1. use OpenVMS as a host for their Glass Fish Application Server > 2. Have free beer for the rest of their lives > 3. both of the above > > Glass Fish is an Open Source initiative. We have port(ing)ed it to OpenVMS > 8.3 > on Alpha and Integrity to try and justify our existence (nothing better to > do...*literally*). I don't think Glassfish is particular interesting from a market perspective. The big players in that market are: 1) IBM WebSphere AS (commercial) 2) BEA WebLogic (commercial) 3) Redhat JBoss (open source) 4) Oracle AS (commercial) #3 runs on VMS. #2 used to be available for VMS - I assume that it still is. #1 is not available for VMS. I have never heard about #4 on VMS, but Oracle do support VMS for a lot of their products so maybe. 2 (maybe 3) out of 4 is not bad. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:12:28 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: More scaremongering bollocks Message-ID: <4718047b$0$90263$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Richard Maher wrote: > PS. Don't let Arne ................................. fool ya, they were > looking for whole teams of those skills in London this summer (and at TOP > DOLLAR) TOP POUND - I assume ... :-) > How's JavaFX going? (Says he who's smugly worked out where the GUI > future lies :-) I know that it is available for download. I don't think it is that popular. My expectation is that it will be 3 out of 3 with Silverlight as #2 and all the Flash stuff at a solid lead. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 07:03:54 +0800 From: "Richard Maher" Subject: Re: Rare job posting Message-ID: Hi Arne, If you go to www.jobserve.co.uk and enter VMS search for all regions, you'll see a few requirements for similar skillsets. Admittedly not a flood but then it hasn't been for over 15 years. Cheers Richard Maher "Arne Vajhøj" wrote in message news:4716cce6$0$90265$14726298@news.sunsite.dk... > I just saw a job posting in Denmark. > > Required skills: VMS, Cobol, ACMS, DECForms, VAX and Alpha. > > Long time since I last saw one of those. > > Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:04:49 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Rare job posting Message-ID: <471802ae$0$90272$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Jan-Erik Söderholm wrote: > Arne Vajhøj wrote: >> I just saw a job posting in Denmark. >> >> Required skills: VMS, Cobol, ACMS, DECForms, VAX and Alpha. >> >> Long time since I last saw one of those. > > In sweden I've seen 1 or 2 jobs postings (culsulting) > each months since this summer. Not in the public > job postings but on "consulting brookers" web sites. > > Mainly full time, 6-12 months jobs. I think this was similar. But it is a long time since I have seen ACMS and DECForms wanted in Denmark. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:05:45 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-15?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Rare job posting Message-ID: <471802e7$0$90272$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Tom Linden wrote: > On Wed, 17 Oct 2007 20:03:03 -0700, Arne Vajhøj wrote: >> I just saw a job posting in Denmark. >> >> Required skills: VMS, Cobol, ACMS, DECForms, VAX and Alpha. >> >> Long time since I last saw one of those. > > What was the name of the company? It was a body shop. I can give you the name of that, but the posting did not say who the real company was. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:08:15 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Rare job posting Message-ID: <4718037d$0$90272$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Richard Maher wrote: > If you go to www.jobserve.co.uk and enter VMS search for all regions, you'll > see a few requirements for similar skillsets. Admittedly not a flood but > then it hasn't been for over 15 years. Denmark is a much smaller country than UK and the financial sector in Denmark has always been very blue. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 20:30:28 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Rare job posting Message-ID: On Thu, 18 Oct 2007 18:08:15 -0700, Arne Vajhøj wrote: > Denmark is a much smaller country than UK and the financial > sector in Denmark has always been very blue. That is because Maersk Mckinney Moeller was a roommate of Tom Watson Jr. at Yale. -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 15:07:38 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Message-ID: <164b0$4717aefd$cef8887a$21719@TEKSAVVY.COM> re: Volcanos Yes, a volcano eruption pollutes the planet a lot. However, those are not daily ocurances, and in the past, the planet was able to absorb what volcanoes threw out. Human activity is a dily occurance. However, if human activity has used up all spare absorbtion capacity and CO2 levels are rising, then any eruption will cause a large amount of additional greenhouse gases to stay in atmosphere because the planet is already at maximum CO2 absorbsion capacity. You need to think of in a budget way. If you spend more money than your earn, your debt levels will rise. If you throw more CO2 than the earth can absorb back, then CO2 levels will rise. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 18:17:27 -0700 From: Neil Rieck Subject: Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Message-ID: <1192756647.705494.45470@q5g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On Oct 8, 9:02 am, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote: > In article <4705367C.9010...@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: > > > Dwight Eisenhower was the last president I had any > > respect for. > > You know, I'm a life-long Democrat and I didn't care for a lot of > things Regan did, nor how he did them, but I give him credit for > ending the cold war and respect for that. > > Too bad W is leting the cold war restart. Reagan didn't end the cold war. The Russians went broke trying to support a militaristic economy. There were many warning signs of this including information from MI6 via Thatcher. NSR ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 18:35:03 -0700 From: Neil Rieck Subject: Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Message-ID: <1192757703.566187.121780@t8g2000prg.googlegroups.com> On Oct 8, 10:04 am, ultra...@gmail.com wrote: > On Oct 7, 11:02 pm, Neil Rieck wrote: > [...snip...] > > > True Christians are non-violent evangelists but many North American > > Christians are obsessed with escatology and other end-time nonsense. > > They think it is OK to destroy the Earth because Christ will return > > soon and make everything right. > > you been following revelation lately? > > 1. when Israel becomes a nation again, the time of the > gentiles will be fulfilled ... 1948 > > 2. He will gather the jews from the all over the world back, > and from the land of the north (Moscow, Russia) ... 1988 > the Berlin wall falls as well as communism and since then > over 2 million jews have left for Israel ... > > 3. wars and rumors of wars ... world war I, II, korean, vietnam, > Iraq 1, Iraq 2, plus many others smaller ones ... Iran? > Israel and Syria? > > 4. children disrespectful to their elders ... happening ... > > 5. earthquakes in divers places ... happening and increasing ... > > 6. old roman empire reforms ... EU > > 7. a failing away from the church ... happening > > when you see these signs, look up, for your redemption is near ... > > Daniel, Isaiah and other prophecies in the bible confirm > revelation ...- Hide quoted text - > I just finished a book on those texts that humans decided to leave out of the orthodox canon. It turns out that there were many Revelations (also caused Apocalypses) because it was a literary genere (like psalms, poetry, lamentations, etc.). The "Revelation of Peter" and the "Revelation of Paul" are two such examples. You are referring to the Revelation of John and it must be mentioned that this John was not the person associated with the Gospel by the same name. The point of all this drivel is this: I now know why many people, including Martin Luther, did not think the Revelation of John should have been included in the orthodox canon. People who have built a religion out of Revelation are mis-guided. NSR ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 18:41:18 -0700 From: Neil Rieck Subject: Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Message-ID: <1192758078.731262.196010@q3g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On Oct 11, 6:07 pm, "Dr. Dweeb" wrote: > Richard B. Gilbert wrote: > [...snip...] > > Your suggestion is unlikely to help in reducing his personal CH4, CO2 or H20 > emmissions. > > Which reminds me, has anyone ever calculated the annual emmissions of a > single individual of these 3 greenhouse components? I mean they are pretty > basic byproducts of life as we know it and reasonable calculations would not > seem to difficult. > > Dr. Dweeb It doesn't matter if you agree or disagree with the concept of man made global warming. General Electric has the point of view all can admire. The Greening of GE http://spectrum.ieee.org/jul05/1565 NSR ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 20:44:12 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: still not convinced global warming a hoax? Message-ID: On 10/18/07 20:17, Neil Rieck wrote: > On Oct 8, 9:02 am, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob > Koehler) wrote: >> In article <4705367C.9010...@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >> >>> Dwight Eisenhower was the last president I had any >>> respect for. >> You know, I'm a life-long Democrat and I didn't care for a lot of >> things Regan did, nor how he did them, but I give him credit for >> ending the cold war and respect for that. >> >> Too bad W is leting the cold war restart. > > Reagan didn't end the cold war. The Russians went broke trying to > support a militaristic economy. There were many warning signs of this > including information from MI6 via Thatcher. And if Carter or (especially) Mondale had been in office, the Soviet appeasers and peaceniks would have slashed the US military budget and the Sovs could have trundled along for quite a while longer. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 14:47:38 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Which delete statement is faster? Message-ID: <1c72b$4717aa4b$cef8887a$13893@TEKSAVVY.COM> Bob Koehler wrote: > Which is OK if the files are small and the real overhead is in > directory file processing. But DFU doesn't have that problem, > so it's a better solution. Does DFU have the ability to selectively delete files from a directory ? From what help says, it can delete whole directories, or delete by file-id. The original poster needs to selectively delete a whole bunch of files in a huge directory. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 14:49:54 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Which delete statement is faster? Message-ID: <87883$4717aad3$cef8887a$13893@TEKSAVVY.COM> A different twist to the original problem: Do the FTP in reverse order. For instance, do all the Z*.*;* files, then delete all the Z*.*;* files. Transfer the Y*.*;* files, then delete all the Y*.*;* files. The current batch of undeleted files could stay there until you've done all the B files, at which point you can delete the A*.*;* files which you originally transfered first. This will make the deletes at each stage much faster since you will be working with files that are towards the end of the directory. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 19:13:41 GMT From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jan-Erik_S=F6derholm?= Subject: Re: Which delete statement is faster? Message-ID: JF Mezei wrote: > Bob Koehler wrote: >> Which is OK if the files are small and the real overhead is in >> directory file processing. But DFU doesn't have that problem, >> so it's a better solution. > > > Does DFU have the ability to selectively delete files from a directory ? No, don't think so, and when *I* originaly mentioned DFU in this thread it was about "emtying" or removing a whole DIR. > From what help says, it can delete whole directories, or delete by file-id. > > The original poster needs to selectively delete a whole bunch of files > in a huge directory. As this, as far as I understand, is a one time effort to clean up efter a system or user error, I think that the easiest route is to just take the time to copy and delete the files using regular DCL. If one use DFU at some intervalls to compress the DIR file, one will ge a better performance after a while... Note, if there have been some creates/deletes in this DIR over time, it could be a good idea to run a DFU "directory compress" right from the beginning to get the smallest possible DIR file with the current files in it. The smaller the DIR file is, the faster the deletes run. Jan-Erik. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Oct 2007 16:18:53 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Which delete statement is faster? Message-ID: In article <1c72b$4717aa4b$cef8887a$13893@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei writes: > Bob Koehler wrote: >> Which is OK if the files are small and the real overhead is in >> directory file processing. But DFU doesn't have that problem, >> so it's a better solution. > > > Does DFU have the ability to selectively delete files from a directory ? > From what help says, it can delete whole directories, or delete by file-id. Oops, your right. The op would have to get the FID first, such as by dir/file_id or f$file_attributes() ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:44:55 -0500 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: Which delete statement is faster? Message-ID: <47181A27.A8758A92@spam.comcast.net> Ron Johnson wrote: > > On 10/18/07 06:55, Hein RMS van den Heuvel wrote: > > On Oct 18, 3:47 am, Ron Johnson wrote: > >> On 10/18/07 01:00, Rudolf Wingert wrote: > >> > >>> Hello, > >>> I think, that the fastest delete is the following: > >>> BACKUP/DELETE A*.*;* NL:T/SAVE/NOCRC/GROUP=0 > >>> AFAIK this will do all what you want in the right way (reverse order of > >>> delete). > >> But it wastes so much CPU & IO reading thru all the files. > >> > >> $ PIPE DIRE/COL=1/NOHEAD/NOTRAIL DISK$FOO:[BAR]*.* | - > >> SORT/KEY=(POS:1,SIZE:,DESC) SYS$PIPE FOO_BAR.TXT > >> Then DCL to delete them: > > : > >> $LTOP: > >> $ READ/END=LEND IFILE IREC > >> $ DEL/LOG 'IREC' > > > > Het middle is erger dan de kwaal? > > > > Speaking of wasteful... what about that image activation for each > > delete. Yikes! > > Good point. Then read 3-4 records, concatenating them into one > larger string and then delete that. Damn DCL for having in 2007 a > 240 byte max record size! As of V7.3-2 and later, DCL's "record" (max cmd) length is 4KB (4095, actually). -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:52:42 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: www.hp.com/go/openvms is still toast Message-ID: <47180de7$0$90271$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> warren sander wrote: > The current server is located in a data center that is closing. It was > supposed to be closed by the end of > october and several of the groups have already re-allocated their resources > into the new data centers in > atlanta, houston and austin. > > I'm still working the exception for the OpenVMS server to continue to be on > OpenVMS and in the TAY data > center until that center really 'exits'. The problem is that most of the > external connectivity in that center > has moved already and I'm part of the stub left behind. That has caused some > issues like the switch got > something done to it on sunday morning not sending a blast out that was > acted on. Until I was in and couldn't > get to the site and contacted the folks left in TAY to fix it there hadn't > been a call logged. The server was up > and the pings to the server were working so the IT folks on my side of the > firewall were never alerted. We know that it is a big move. At least those of us that has read the story at TSS: http://www.theserverside.com/tt/articles/article.tss?l=AStudyofHP Sounds very easy ! :-) Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 21:53:12 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: www.hp.com/go/openvms is still toast Message-ID: <47180e05$0$90271$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Jan-Erik Söderholm wrote: > Sounds like just about any other OpenVMS sysmgr out there. > Forgotten, left behind, never thought of... :-) But is that bad or good ???? :-) Arne ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 18:46:36 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: [OT-Funny] Does this remind you of anyone? Message-ID: http://www.skepticreport.com/lighterside/woowoocredo.htm -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.571 ************************