INFO-VAX Sun, 26 Aug 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 467 Contents: (Persona services came out in VMS 6.2) Re: ACLS and WebServers... Re: (Persona services came out in VMS 6.2) Re: ACLS and WebServers... Re: 4MM DAT tapes read/write Re: 4MM DAT tapes read/write 4MM DAT tapes read/write (was:Re: COBOL Transactions?) Re: ACLS and WebServers... Re: ACLS and WebServers... Re: ACLS and WebServers... Re: ACLS and WebServers... RE: ACLS and WebServers... Re: ACLS and WebServers... RE: ACLS and WebServers... Re: Alan Winston, when are you correcting your WASD book? RE: COBOL Perform? Re: COBOL Perform? Re: COBOL Perform? Re: COBOL Transactions? Re: COBOL Transactions? Re: COBOL Transactions? RE: COBOL Transactions? Re: Context lexical functions Re: Context lexical functions Re: DECnet-Plus for a hobbyist Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Re: Itanium Port Question Re: Itanium Port Question Re: Itanium Port Question Re: Itanium porting question Re: Itanium porting question Re: Wisconsin professor says global warming a hoax! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 12:13:14 +0800 From: "Richard Maher" Subject: (Persona services came out in VMS 6.2) Re: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: Hi John, > When did you look? There is a DECC feature to enable that check. Is it a "DEC"C specific and non-portable extension? In which case I'd like to ask why you wouldn't choose instead to deploy sys$check_access et al? Is "access() for "files" only and doesn't handle access checks to Queues, Mailboxes and so on? Maybe it's only me, but I just can't help wondering why (in these more modern [sys$/t3$]persona_assume times) one wouldn't just have one's processs "become" the client before attempting to perform work on their behalf. Just let VMS sort out what they can and cannot do; seems eminently sensible to me! So you check that FRED has access to an object and hopefully trigger whatever auditing/alarms the System Manager has defined, and then you access it as SUPER/BIGBOY and do some more dodgy auditing and accounting and quota abuse? You're probably equally disinterested in the fact that Rdb provides the "SQL> Set Session Authorization" syntax so that you can change persona within a database attach; but if not, do please ask them why we have to supply a Username/Password in the clear rather than a simple persona ID. (But then you guys see nothing wrong with running up seperate image(s) for each client request, so I'm sure you're equally happy to detach/re-attach to the database each time?) As far as the OP's question goes, can someone tell me if you still need that APACHE$WWW ACE if the WORLD has read access to the files? Not that's it's important, but just for curiosity's sake I'm wondering if what is being achieved is a regime where every bloke and a dog with a browser can view the files but there's just no way we'll let local VMS users see them. Cheers Richard Maher "John E. Malmberg" wrote in message news:CD5Ai.76110$Fc.8267@attbi_s21... > Martin Vorlaender wrote: > > > > In fact, when porting some *ix software, I noticed that the C RTL > > routine access() only looks at the protection mask, and doesn't honor > > ACLs. So I had to expand it (not going all the way through the flowchart > > though). > > When did you look? There is a DECC feature to enable that check. I do > not know what version it was added in. > > -John > wb8tyw@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 04:47:55 GMT From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing) Subject: Re: (Persona services came out in VMS 6.2) Re: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: <00A6CAEA.0EB55700@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> In article , "Richard Maher" writes: > >As far as the OP's question goes, can someone tell me if you still need that >APACHE$WWW ACE if the WORLD has read access to the files? Not that's it's >important, but just for curiosity's sake I'm wondering if what is being >achieved is a regime where every bloke and a dog with a browser can view the >files but there's just no way we'll let local VMS users see them. > Nope, the APACHE$WWW ACE isn't required for files that are W:R. (Of course, there tend to be fewer and fewer local VMS users who actually log in, get an interactive session, and do stuff.) -- Alan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 19:33:34 -0400 From: Glenn Everhart Subject: Re: 4MM DAT tapes read/write Message-ID: <46D0BC4E.4090305@gce.com> Brad Hamilton wrote: > In article <1188069083.626943.60150@q5g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, AEF wrote: > [...] >> The only problem I see with VMS not recognizing your 4mm-drive is that >> it doesn't give the appropriate error message: >> >> %CONFIGURE-F-BLEAH, 4mm-tape drive? You've got to be kidding. >> -SYSTEM-F-COUGHCOUGH, I'm not working with that! >> >> (Now THAT would be humorous!) [...] > Again, I will say that DLT is vastly superior, but Paul should not be > discouraged from using DAT, if that is indeed the only (or most economical) > choice for tape backup. > [...] > I have had no problems with DAT over the years (or for that matter with 8mm) provided the heads were clean and the drive alignment not out. Using ztdriver they work nicely even across DECnet. You do have to be aware of the several flavors of these tapes, though, which are not interchangeable. The oldest DAT tapes hold as I recall about 1.2GB on 60' media. Next gen is 90' media, holds a couple gigs each, the next is 120' and holds 3 or 4 GB and so on. The older drives cannot reliably work with new tapes. This has nothing to do with the OS and everything to do with the drives. (Same happens with DLT by the way. Doubters can try writing TK50 or TK70 tape in a modern DLT if they dare. Similar size and appearance is NOT everything!! There are in fact relatively few devices that fail with VMS. There are ways to write media VMS will not grok (tape with blocksize over 64K for example, unless that has been fixed) and filestructures VMS does not know, but VMS has been historically pretty darn good at handling data processing gadgets, at times needing third party controllers. From very early days, VMS has had tape file structure processors to handle file structured tape. It also has had utilities, as unix has had, but it has been able to treat tape on a par with disk as a file structured device (with limitations derived from the devices and from the shortcomings of the ANSI standards), a feat many OSs never heard of. It is true though that DAT is very susceptible to tape damage and drives must be handled with much care if you don't want your tape turned into magnetic confetti. Glenn Everhart ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 04:06:08 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: 4MM DAT tapes read/write Message-ID: In article <46D0BC4E.4090305@gce.com>, Glenn Everhart wrote: > It is true though that DAT is very susceptible to tape damage and drives must > be > handled with much care if you don't want your tape turned into magnetic > confetti. I've seen that happen to a DAT and "magnetic confetti" is an accurate description. -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 17:06:13 -0500 From: bradhamilton@comcast.net (Brad Hamilton) Subject: 4MM DAT tapes read/write (was:Re: COBOL Transactions?) Message-ID: In article <1188069083.626943.60150@q5g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, AEF wrote: [...] >The only problem I see with VMS not recognizing your 4mm-drive is that >it doesn't give the appropriate error message: > >%CONFIGURE-F-BLEAH, 4mm-tape drive? You've got to be kidding. >-SYSTEM-F-COUGHCOUGH, I'm not working with that! > >(Now THAT would be humorous!) > >The 4mm-DAT format is a write-probably/read-maybe one. So if you care >about your data, I'd get something better. Thank your lucky stars that >VMS is warning you about this! My experience with 4mm tapes and drives differs (thank goodness!) Of course, I prefer DLT in term of speed and reliability, but in my last VMS job, I was forced to use 4mm tape drives. We ran BACKUP/IMAGE on or disks every night, and re-used the tapes regularly. I was able to restore (many times over) individual files inadvertantly deleted by our customers, as well as whole disks that had logged hundreds of errors over a short time, and needed to be replaced. Again, I will say that DLT is vastly superior, but Paul should not be discouraged from using DAT, if that is indeed the only (or most economical) choice for tape backup. [...] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 22:05:26 GMT From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jan-Erik_S=F6derholm?= Subject: Re: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: Paul Raulerson wrote: > P.S. This sounds like an opportunity for a neat little > utility for someone who is capable of writing it. What happend to my former post about DFU ??? I thought I saw it on the list after posting it... http://h71000.www7.hp.com/freeware/freeware70/dfu/ Regards, Jan-Erik. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 18:37:30 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: On Sat, 25 Aug 2007 09:16:45 -0700, Larry Kilgallen wrote: > In article <002501c7e72f$e4060f30$ac122d90$@com>, "Paul Raulerson" > writes: > >> That's something definitely in the cards. What is WASD exactly? > > WASD is a web server that runs on VMS. > > http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ WASD was specifically written for VMS whereas Apache was ported from a UNIX environment. Do yourself a favor, if you are going to run a web server, it is WASD -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 02:33:06 GMT From: "John E. Malmberg" Subject: Re: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: Martin Vorlaender wrote: > > In fact, when porting some *ix software, I noticed that the C RTL > routine access() only looks at the protection mask, and doesn't honor > ACLs. So I had to expand it (not going all the way through the flowchart > though). When did you look? There is a DECC feature to enable that check. I do not know what version it was added in. -John wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 05:36:07 +0200 From: "Martin Vorlaender" Subject: Re: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: John E. Malmberg wrote: > Martin Vorlaender wrote: >> In fact, when porting some *ix software, I noticed that the C RTL >> routine access() only looks at the protection mask, and doesn't honor >> ACLs. > > When did you look? There is a DECC feature to enable that check. I do > not know what version it was added in. I'm pretty sure DECC$ACL_ACCESS_CHECK wasn't in the docs then, at least. Thanks for the pointer. cu, Martin -- One OS to rule them all | Martin Vorlaender | OpenVMS rules! One OS to find them | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de One OS to bring them all | http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/ And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin.vorlaender@t-online.de ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 22:44:54 -0500 From: "Paul Raulerson" Subject: RE: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: <001501c7e793$774f6850$65ee38f0$@com> > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Linden [mailto:tom@kednos.company] > Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 8:38 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: Re: ACLS and WebServers... > > On Sat, 25 Aug 2007 09:16:45 -0700, Larry Kilgallen > wrote: > > > In article <002501c7e72f$e4060f30$ac122d90$@com>, "Paul Raulerson" > > writes: > > > >> That's something definitely in the cards. What is WASD exactly? > > > > WASD is a web server that runs on VMS. > > > > http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ > > WASD was specifically written for VMS whereas Apache was ported from a > UNIX environment. > Do yourself a favor, if you are going to run a web server, it is WASD > > > -- > PL/I for OpenVMS > www.kednos.com Downloaded and starting to read the documentation on it. Apache is up and running so ... to bring up and configure WASD means I either need to IPL from another volume, or figure out how to *uninstall* Apache... I'll get it up and give it a try, it looks pretty nice. I like the PASS syntax. -Paul ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 06:38:20 +0200 From: "Martin Vorlaender" Subject: Re: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: [WASD] Paul Raulerson wrote: > Downloaded and starting to read the documentation on it. Apache is up > and running so ... > to bring up and configure WASD means I either need to IPL from another > volume, or figure out how to *uninstall* Apache... While you can uninstall Apache (via the PRODUCT REMOVE command), both webservers provide the possibility to set the port they're listening at. If the ports are different, you can run both in parallel. cu, Martin -- One OS to rule them all | Martin Vorlaender | OpenVMS rules! One OS to find them | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de One OS to bring them all | http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/ And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin.vorlaender@t-online.de ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 04:42:12 GMT From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing) Subject: RE: ACLS and WebServers... Message-ID: <00A6CAE9.423F7ADC@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> In article <001501c7e793$774f6850$65ee38f0$@com>, "Paul Raulerson" writes: > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Tom Linden [mailto:tom@kednos.company] >> Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 8:38 PM >> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >> Subject: Re: ACLS and WebServers... >> >> On Sat, 25 Aug 2007 09:16:45 -0700, Larry Kilgallen >> wrote: >> >> > In article <002501c7e72f$e4060f30$ac122d90$@com>, "Paul Raulerson" >> > writes: >> > >> >> That's something definitely in the cards. What is WASD exactly? >> > >> > WASD is a web server that runs on VMS. >> > >> > http://wasd.vsm.com.au/ >> >> WASD was specifically written for VMS whereas Apache was ported from a >> UNIX environment. >> Do yourself a favor, if you are going to run a web server, it is WASD >> >> >> -- >> PL/I for OpenVMS >> www.kednos.com > >Downloaded and starting to read the documentation on it. Apache is up and >running so ... to bring >up and configure WASD means I either need to IPL from another volume, or >figure out how to *uninstall* >Apache... Actually, you don't need to do either of those. Just configure WASD to run on some other port than you've got Apache running on. (On my home VMS box - which is where I'm sitting as I type this, DECnetted into my work machine - I'm running OSU, Apache, and WASD simultaneously.) The various logical names and account names they require don't overlap. (One hint: If you're going to give the web server ACL-based access to things, don't do it by the username of the account (eg, APACHE$WWW). Instead, make up another identifier (I use WEB_DAEMON) and give *that* the read access to your web directories. YOu can grant that id to APACHE$WWW, or the accounts for WASD or OSU, rather than having to rework everything.) -- Alan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 21:42:18 -0500 (CDT) From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: Re: Alan Winston, when are you correcting your WASD book? Message-ID: <07082521421814_2022C7FA@antinode.org> From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing) > >> $ unzip "-v" htrootxxx.zip > >> $ unzip "-v" opensslwasdxxxx > >> > >> well, it should read > >> > >> $ unzip "-v" htrootxxx.zip > >> $ set def [.ht_root] > >> $ unzip "-v" [-]opensslwasdxxx My question would be, 'Why the quotation of "-v"?' I can see why "-V" might need quotation, but not "-v". ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Steven M. Schweda sms@antinode-org 382 South Warwick Street (+1) 651-699-9818 Saint Paul MN 55105-2547 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 12:55:39 -0500 From: "Paul Raulerson" Subject: RE: COBOL Perform? Message-ID: <000001c7e741$261b43c0$7251cb40$@com> Urk - as soon as I got up and walked away, it because obvious. This is not a called program and really needs a STOP RUN in the VMS environment. Lack of sleep caught me on this one again. Not an excuse, but in the IBM world, *everything* is a called program, so GOBACK works everywhere. In my head I had done a :EXIT PROGRAM = GOBACK: thing. -Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul Raulerson [mailto:paul@raulersons.com] > Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 12:47 PM > To: (Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com) > Subject: COBOL Perform? > > Can someone explain this little bit of COBOL behavior (Alpha VMS 8.3) > please? > > I expected the EXIT PROGRAM to terminate the program at the end of > the mainline, but it seems to fall through and go execute the > paragraphs below it. EXIT PROGRAM does appear to be working this > way elsewhere in code. Huh. maybe I am just too tired right now > and am missing something utterly simple. I'm used to using GOBACK. > > I did stay up wayyyy to late last night. ;) > > The below is a condensed sample program to illustrate what I mean, > and the output is reproduced below it. > > Thanks > -Paul > > *************************************************************** > * .MC80-A > * SAMPLE CODE FOR PERFORM ISSUE > *************************************************************** > > IDENTIFICATION DIVISION. > PROGRAM-ID. MC80 INITIAL. > > DATA DIVISION. > WORKING-STORAGE SECTION. > 01 WS-EOF-FLAG PIC X(1) VALUE 'N'. > > PROCEDURE DIVISION. > START-PROGRAM. > DISPLAY '**** FIRST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE ****' > MOVE 'N' TO WS-EOF-FLAG > PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > PERFORM UNTIL WS-EOF-FLAG = 'Y' > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM UNTIL' > MOVE 'Y' TO WS-EOF-FLAG > END-PERFORM > PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > DISPLAY '**** LAST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE ****' > EXIT PROGRAM > . > > WRITE-TEXT1. > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1' > . > > WRITE-TEXT2. > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2' > . > > > ===== output from above program is ===== > > $ link mc80 > $ r mc80 > **** FIRST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE **** > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > TEXT FROM PERFORM UNTIL > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > **** LAST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE **** > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > $ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 07:57:37 +0800 From: "Richard Maher" Subject: Re: COBOL Perform? Message-ID: Hi Paul, This was a standards thing. The code used to work as you expected (and will work that way again if you compile with /standards=v3 or whatever) but was changed to comply with something else. I believe that people used to use it to pass a return status back to DCL. Cheers Richard Maher PS. Uppercase is also not compulsory on VMS and can give us COBOL guys a bad name :-) "Paul Raulerson" wrote in message news:000001c7e741$261b43c0$7251cb40$@com... > Urk - as soon as I got up and walked away, it because obvious. > This is not a called program and really needs a STOP RUN in > the VMS environment. Lack of sleep caught me on this one > again. Not an excuse, but in the IBM world, *everything* is a > called program, so GOBACK works everywhere. In my head I had > done a :EXIT PROGRAM = GOBACK: thing. > > -Paul > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Paul Raulerson [mailto:paul@raulersons.com] > > Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2007 12:47 PM > > To: (Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com) > > Subject: COBOL Perform? > > > > Can someone explain this little bit of COBOL behavior (Alpha VMS 8.3) > > please? > > > > I expected the EXIT PROGRAM to terminate the program at the end of > > the mainline, but it seems to fall through and go execute the > > paragraphs below it. EXIT PROGRAM does appear to be working this > > way elsewhere in code. Huh. maybe I am just too tired right now > > and am missing something utterly simple. I'm used to using GOBACK. > > > > I did stay up wayyyy to late last night. ;) > > > > The below is a condensed sample program to illustrate what I mean, > > and the output is reproduced below it. > > > > Thanks > > -Paul > > > > *************************************************************** > > * .MC80-A > > * SAMPLE CODE FOR PERFORM ISSUE > > *************************************************************** > > > > IDENTIFICATION DIVISION. > > PROGRAM-ID. MC80 INITIAL. > > > > DATA DIVISION. > > WORKING-STORAGE SECTION. > > 01 WS-EOF-FLAG PIC X(1) VALUE 'N'. > > > > PROCEDURE DIVISION. > > START-PROGRAM. > > DISPLAY '**** FIRST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE ****' > > MOVE 'N' TO WS-EOF-FLAG > > PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > > PERFORM UNTIL WS-EOF-FLAG = 'Y' > > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM UNTIL' > > MOVE 'Y' TO WS-EOF-FLAG > > END-PERFORM > > PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > > DISPLAY '**** LAST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE ****' > > EXIT PROGRAM > > . > > > > WRITE-TEXT1. > > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1' > > . > > > > WRITE-TEXT2. > > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2' > > . > > > > > > ===== output from above program is ===== > > > > $ link mc80 > > $ r mc80 > > **** FIRST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE **** > > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > > TEXT FROM PERFORM UNTIL > > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > > **** LAST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE **** > > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > > $ > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 23:51:41 -0600 From: Jeff Campbell Subject: Re: COBOL Perform? Message-ID: <1188107325_8137@sp12lax.superfeed.net> Paul Raulerson wrote: > Can someone explain this little bit of COBOL behavior (Alpha VMS 8.3) > please? > > I expected the EXIT PROGRAM to terminate the program at the end of > the mainline, but it seems to fall through and go execute the > paragraphs below it. EXIT PROGRAM does appear to be working this > way elsewhere in code. Huh. maybe I am just too tired right now > and am missing something utterly simple. I'm used to using GOBACK. > > I did stay up wayyyy to late last night. ;) > > The below is a condensed sample program to illustrate what I mean, > and the output is reproduced below it. > > Thanks > -Paul > > *************************************************************** > * .MC80-A > * SAMPLE CODE FOR PERFORM ISSUE > *************************************************************** > > IDENTIFICATION DIVISION. > PROGRAM-ID. MC80 INITIAL. > > DATA DIVISION. > WORKING-STORAGE SECTION. > 01 WS-EOF-FLAG PIC X(1) VALUE 'N'. > > PROCEDURE DIVISION. > START-PROGRAM. > DISPLAY '**** FIRST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE ****' > MOVE 'N' TO WS-EOF-FLAG > PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > PERFORM UNTIL WS-EOF-FLAG = 'Y' > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM UNTIL' > MOVE 'Y' TO WS-EOF-FLAG > END-PERFORM > PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > DISPLAY '**** LAST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE ****' > EXIT PROGRAM > . > > WRITE-TEXT1. > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1' > . > > WRITE-TEXT2. > DISPLAY ' TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2' > . > > > ===== output from above program is ===== > > $ link mc80 > $ r mc80 > **** FIRST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE **** > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > TEXT FROM PERFORM UNTIL > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > **** LAST LINE OF MAINLINE CODE **** > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT1 > TEXT FROM PERFORM WRITE-TEXT2 > $ > You need to use STOP RUN, instead of EXIT PROGRAM or GOBACK. Jeff ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==---- http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 20:11:03 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: COBOL Transactions? Message-ID: In article , Ron Johnson wrote: > he problem is that SQLite does not enforce datatype definitions. > > (The authors say this is a design decision and feature.) Thanks for the heads up. -- Paul Sture Sue's OpenVMS bookmarks: http://eisner.encompasserve.org/~sture/ovms-bookmarks.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 13:50:09 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: COBOL Transactions? Message-ID: On 08/25/07 13:11, P. Sture wrote: > In article , > Ron Johnson wrote: > >> he problem is that SQLite does not enforce datatype definitions. >> >> (The authors say this is a design decision and feature.) > > Thanks for the heads up. Note that I do (enthusiastically) use SQLite as an ISAM replacement in Python. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 12:11:23 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: COBOL Transactions? Message-ID: <1188069083.626943.60150@q5g2000prf.googlegroups.com> On Aug 24, 11:52 pm, "Paul Raulerson" wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ron Johnson [mailto:ron.l.john...@cox.net] > > Sent: Friday, August 24, 2007 10:17 PM > > To: Info-...@Mvb.Saic.Com > > Subject: Re: COBOL Transactions? > > > On 08/24/07 20:36, Paul Raulerson wrote: > > >> On Aug 24, 11:15 am, "Paul Raulerson" wrote: > > > [snip] > > > >> For example, here are some things you have said ... > > > >>>>> The only issue with the Alpha is that the 4mm tape drive on it > > >>>>> does not seem to be recognized. ... and off to the UNIX machine > > >>>>> which *does* know how to talk to tape. > [...] > > I *GUARANTEE* you that thousands of small VMS sites over the years > > have used 4mm and 8mm DAT drives to backup their data. > > And what has that go to do with anything? > > > You've *obviously* and *definitely* done something wrong, and are > > too dense to realize that you are making insultingly *stupid* comments. > > Really? Well, I guess I will just go on being dense then. Please explain > to me why I should believe I have misconfigured a SCSI bus that everything > else, disk, CD, etc, *works* on, the device is seen by the BIOS, and oh > yeah, > if I pull the drive, like I just did, and put it on another machine, it > works > fine. > > I'd say that VMS does not support that device. The only problem I see with VMS not recognizing your 4mm-drive is that it doesn't give the appropriate error message: %CONFIGURE-F-BLEAH, 4mm-tape drive? You've got to be kidding. -SYSTEM-F-COUGHCOUGH, I'm not working with that! (Now THAT would be humorous!) The 4mm-DAT format is a write-probably/read-maybe one. So if you care about your data, I'd get something better. Thank your lucky stars that VMS is warning you about this! Tip: I've found that DDS-1 tapes work much better than DDS-2 tapes on TLZ07 and TLZ09 drives (which are 4mm-DAT drives). I have a DLT drive now (TZ88N-VA) and so far it works like a charm! |-: OK, I don't know what the real problem is, but I'd get a better drive regardless. :-| AEF [...] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 22:31:01 -0500 From: "Paul Raulerson" Subject: RE: COBOL Transactions? Message-ID: <000f01c7e791$872101f0$956305d0$@com> > > The only problem I see with VMS not recognizing your 4mm-drive is that > it doesn't give the appropriate error message: > > %CONFIGURE-F-BLEAH, 4mm-tape drive? You've got to be kidding. > -SYSTEM-F-COUGHCOUGH, I'm not working with that! > I somehow would not put it past it to do just exactly that! :) > (Now THAT would be humorous!) > > The 4mm-DAT format is a write-probably/read-maybe one. So if you care > about your data, I'd get something better. Thank your lucky stars that > VMS is warning you about this! > > Tip: I've found that DDS-1 tapes work much better than DDS-2 tapes on > TLZ07 and TLZ09 drives (which are 4mm-DAT drives). I have a DLT drive > now (TZ88N-VA) and so far it works like a charm! > > |-: OK, I don't know what the real problem is, but I'd get a better > drive regardless. :-| > I have the same DLT drive you do, and an IBM branded LTO drive. I generally run backups to the DLT, mostly because I have more tapes for it. Anything like essays or articles, or especially source code, gets copied three places as well as to tape, and once a week to DVD. -Paul > AEF > > [...] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 13:04:20 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: Context lexical functions Message-ID: <1188072260.925850.77170@d55g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Aug 25, 10:29 am, "John E. Malmberg" wrote: > Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOeGER wrote: > > As you might know there are some lexical functions for getting information > > of a particular entity (like F$GETDVI, F$GETJPI, F$FILE_ATTRIBUTE) and > > a companion lexical function for wildcard searches of these entities > > (like F$DEVICE, F$CONTEXT/F$PID, F$SEARCH). > > > Now with ODS5 and/or symbolic links, I think, there should be some > > improvement in the F$SEARCH function area. > > > eg. How to specify that F$SEARCH should not follow a subdirectory > > (just like a DIR/EXC does, but lexical functions are there to not need to > > parse DCL output in temporary files, right?) or symbolic link? > > This would be handy to avoid an endless loop via SYS$COMMON:[GNV.MNT...] > > (which is an alias for usually SYS$SYSDEVICE:[PSX$ROOT.MNT...]) > > I solved the endless loop problem a different way: > > Seeftp://ftp.encompasserve.org/gnv/. In particular > gnv_com_2_1_patch_important_readme.txt . > > I have also submitted that to the HP GNV maintainer, but have not seen a > response yet. > > Since then I found out that setting hard link or a mount point to "/" > deeper in a directory tree is a "BAD THING" on UNIX and will cause the > same type of endless looping problems in a directory search. What? How can "/" be deeper than itself? > It seems that you must not ever put a mount point or a hard link of a > parent directory anywhere that it could be a child of that directory. > The O'Reilly "Learning Perl" manual implies that most UNIXes prevent > such a hard link from being made. Can you please give an example? I don't understand what you're saying. Don't make a parent directory a child of what directory? You mean make no siblings, or cousins, or cousins once removed? Do you mean "any parent", "the parent", any child, etc.? Please clarify, preferably with a clear, explicit example. Grandparents, uncles, aunts, grandchildren, nieces, and nephews? > And since "/" is the parent of all, it must never have a mount point or > a hard link pointing to it. So I assume you mean that you should not link directories such that link A is a subdirectory of link B or vice versa, right? (Where a subdirectory can be any number of levels down from the referenced directory. Thus, given [A.B.C.D], then [A.B], [A.B.C], [A.B.C.D] are all subdirectories of [A].) If this is right, no example will be needed. [...] > -John > wb8...@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only Thanks! AEF ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 00:22:56 GMT From: "John E. Malmberg" Subject: Re: Context lexical functions Message-ID: AEF wrote: > > So I assume you mean that you should not link directories such that > link A is a subdirectory of link B or vice versa, right? (Where a > subdirectory can be any number of levels down from the referenced > directory. Thus, given [A.B.C.D], then [A.B], [A.B.C], [A.B.C.D] are > all subdirectories of [A].) You should not have a link to A as a subdirectory anywhere under A. So B, C, D, can not be links to A. > If this is right, no example will be needed. That is right, and it also applies to mount points, as they can cause the same looping. You can have [a.b.c.d] and [a.e.c.d], where e.dir is a link of b.dir So there is no problem with /bin having /disk/vms$common/gnv/bin mounted on it because there is no loop in the directory. If it is the same device than an alias or a hard link could be used instead of a mount point. -John wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 22:31:42 GMT From: "Robert Jarratt" Subject: Re: DECnet-Plus for a hobbyist Message-ID: "John Santos" wrote in message news:M_Nzi.7635$Bv1.4100@trnddc06... >> At least some DECservers can boot using either MOP or BOOTP (TCP/IP >> protocol). It attempts to boot using whatever was successful the last >> time. If you have, as I once did, something that will answer a BOOTP >> request, and a MOP boot fails, you can get a situation where the >> DECserver switches over to BOOTP. The way out is to connect it to a VMS >> system with a crossover cable making sure that VMS cannot respond to a >> BOOTP request. When BOOTP fails it will try MOP which succeeds and >> resets things. I have not enabled BOOTP, unless it is enabled by default, so this should not apply. > > There is a bit of magic that will cause a DECServer to reset to its > factory default configuration. The exact sequence varies with model, > but for some, I think you hold down the reset button while it's > powering up. Holding down the reset switch during power up fixed my first problem, which was that it printed garbage on the console. I suspect that line was not set to 9600,N,8,1. Now I can see the console, but it just tells me that there is a load failure due to a timeout. > > Does your DECServer have a 7-segment LED display? If so, what is it > doing? (IIRC, for most models, it counts down from about 8 to about > 3 while it selftests, and then waits for a download.) > > Do you have a terminal or emulator you can connect to port 1? Does > it print anything? (8 bit, no parity, 9600 baud, IIRC.) > > Do you see any OPCOM messages on the VMS system when you power up > the DECServer? If the load server (of whatever ilk, DECnet MOP, > LANACP MOP, BOOTP) is running, it should notice the download > request and log an OPCOM message, and then a 2nd message when it > succeeds or fails or defers to another load host. > No, I do not see any OPCOM messages on the console. > If there are no OPCOM messages, two possibilities: 1) If this is > an AUI/Thin-wire DECServer, is the selector switch in the right > position. (Twisted-pair DEC servers shouldn't have this issue :-) > 2) If the DECServer doesn't get a response to its load request, > it will back off for a while and try again. Initially the back off > is a minute or two, but I think it can grow to longer than you're > probably willing to wait... like hours. Power-cycling should > reset this. > This is an AUI box, but there is no selector switch I can see. When the diagnostic lights on the DECserver indicate network activity I can see the lights on the switch flash, so it is doing something and I think it is getting to the LAN. Thanks Rob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 22:48:19 +0200 From: Dirk Munk Subject: Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Message-ID: David J Dachtera wrote: > Ron Johnson wrote: >> On 08/23/07 20:06, David J Dachtera wrote: >>> Tom Linden wrote: >>>> On Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:09:40 -0700, wrote: >>>> >>>>> Being prepared to suffer and die for your faith doesn't imply any >>>>> validity to >>>>> that faith just that you believe in it very strongly. >>>> It suggests a psychosis. >>> Eh, I don't know as I'd go quite that far until the subject turns to homicide >>> bombers and other terrorists. (They're usually called "suicide" bombers; but, >>> homicide is their actual intent. Their own death is merely incidental.) >>> >>> At the risk of sounding like I'm defending anyone, I can't help thinking about >>> the early Christians facing the lions and other horrible fates. Surely, these >>> innocents did nothing to deserve to die that way. THEY were truly martyrs, dying >>> for their chosen convictions, and "convicted" of nothing worthy of death. >> Or Jews in Europe and blacks in America. > > Well, be careful there. > > The British Colonists (before they became "America") brought Africans to North > America against their will under deplorable conditions to live and work under > deplorable conditions, but that had nothing to do with the religious (or any > other) convictions of the Africans. A bit of stupidity on the part of our > forefathers was that they considered the Africans to be human-like, but not > entirely human. > > During the first part of the 20th Century, Jews in Europe were persecuted > because they were Jewish. To be more accurate, they were persecuted and murdered trough out the centuries. In fact things may have been better in the late 19th and early 20th century (before the 1930's) than they ever were. In earlier centuries Jews were not allowed to be member of a guild, which meant that they were not allowed to exercise many professions. That is why there are relatively many Jewish bankers, and why there are many Jews in the diamond trade. There were no guilds for these professions. The Western allieds knew all to well what was going on in Auschwitz, but they never tried to bomb the gas chambers etc. "It was to far away for the bombers" they explained after the war. That was a big lie, there are photographs of Liberator bombers over Auschwitz on their way to the Hermann Göring Werke where the Germans produced fuel (gasoline) out of coal. These factories belonged to the larger Auschwitz complex. The fact is the Western allieds didn't care very much for the Jews at that time, and certainly not enough to risk a few bombers. It was only after the war when it became very visible to the public what had happened that the general attitude to Jews changed. In Eastern Europe (Poland for instance) there were pogroms long after WWII ended. And I never felt more ashamed for my country as when I heard how returning Jews were treated in The Netherlands. > Remember: Jews were considered a race more than a > religious denomination. It could just as easily have been purple people > persecuting the green because they were green and not purple. The Nazis > targetted racial purity more than religious leanings (the "master race" thing). > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 19:05:18 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Message-ID: <3t3Ai.184889$dA7.95259@newsfe16.lga> On 08/25/07 15:48, Dirk Munk wrote: [snip] > > The Western allieds knew all to well what was going on in Auschwitz, but > they never tried to bomb the gas chambers etc. "It was to far away for > the bombers" they explained after the war. I've never heard that excuse/reason. > That was a big lie, there are > photographs of Liberator bombers over Auschwitz on their way to the Given the (*abysmal* lack of) accuracy of high-altitude bombing, any attacks on Auschwitz were just as likely to hit the town, pastures, or kill the prisoners. > Hermann Göring Werke where the Germans produced fuel (gasoline) out of > coal. Which is more likely to shorten the war? Bombing a prison or bombing a synfuel complex. You know my answer... > These factories belonged to the larger Auschwitz complex. The fact > is the Western allieds didn't care very much for the Jews at that time, > and certainly not enough to risk a few bombers. It was only after the > war when it became very visible to the public what had happened that the > general attitude to Jews changed. > > In Eastern Europe (Poland for instance) there were pogroms long after > WWII ended. And I never felt more ashamed for my country as when I heard > how returning Jews were treated in The Netherlands. I didn't know that... -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 26 Aug 2007 00:53:04 -0000 From: ultradwc@gmail.com Subject: Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Message-ID: <1188089584.391444.32120@w3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Aug 23, 5:52 pm, Neil Rieck wrote: > On Aug 23, 9:32 am, ultra...@gmail.com wrote: > > > On Aug 22, 10:55 pm, Neil Rieck wrote: > > > are you dense? The sites show they found pieces > > of New testament that date anywhere from just after > > John to the first century ... and those writings translate > > to what the bible is now ... so you wish to continue to > > deny God and His words, that is not my problem, it's > > yours ... the proof is there as always with everything > > in the bible, whether you wish to accept it is another > > thing ... > > You had better check the peer-reviewed sources. There are no (none, > zero) original manuscripts of the new testament going back to the > original authors. The earliest gospel written was Mark which most > bible scholars think was written between 70-80 AD. If you agree that > Jesus died in 30 AD at the age of 33, then the gospels were being > handed on via an oral mechanism for at least 40 years before someone > decided to put it into writing. and just because these cannot be found now does not mean they never existed ... > It is almost like God does NOT want us to have access to the original > texts. no, its more like God has given you His text but you do not want to believe Him ... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 20:53:16 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: Here's one for Bob (hope it makes your head spin) Message-ID: On 08/25/07 19:53, ultradwc@gmail.com wrote: > On Aug 23, 5:52 pm, Neil Rieck wrote: [snip] >> You had better check the peer-reviewed sources. There are no (none, >> zero) original manuscripts of the new testament going back to the >> original authors. The earliest gospel written was Mark which most >> bible scholars think was written between 70-80 AD. If you agree that >> Jesus died in 30 AD at the age of 33, then the gospels were being >> handed on via an oral mechanism for at least 40 years before someone >> decided to put it into writing. > > and just because these cannot be found now does > not mean they never existed ... I hate it when I agree with Boob. >> It is almost like God does NOT want us to have access to the original >> texts. > > no, its more like God has given you His text but > you do not want to believe Him ... Whew. Back to thinking he's a boob. -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 23:33:15 +0200 From: Evert van Dijken Subject: Re: Itanium Port Question Message-ID: Depends on you programming language, Only macro needs to be rewritten. And your third party software, when you have that, needs to be compiled on the Itanium. When you want to speed-up you need to get rid of allignment failures when they show up. Evert. Randy Park schreef: > I've been called in to help with a port to Itanium on some software that I was > the prime developer for many many years. I haven't touched a VMS system in > 4 years, plus I only worked part time on VMS for the previous 6 years. So here > goes. > > The application is a commerical tool sold into the VMS marketplace. It supports > many databases (Rdb, Oracle, etc.) plus RMS. All at the same time. But not all > customers have all databases, let alone even one database. In order to make > one set of images work for all customers we would go through the following > generalized build procedure: > > 1. Compile all source code > 2. Link executable images with all databases up and running. > 3. Shut down database A. > 4. Link again, and note all unresolved symbols. > 5. Create shareable image(s) with stub routines containing entry points from step 4. > 6. Redefine logicals relevant to database A to point to shareable image from stop 5 > 7. Run and test software with database A missing > 8. Repeat steps 3 through 7 for every database system. > > Notes: > 1. All databases used shareable images. > 2. During startup time, DCL procedures would look to see which databases were > present and define logicals to point to stub images for missing databases. > > This general build process would work for almost all databases on Vax and Alpha. > There were some strange things regarding CDD that I don't recall right now. > > The developers involved in the port are telling me that this general process no longer > works on Itanium. They're getting some kind of "ELF" error message. (I'm trying to > get the exact error message from them.) > > Any idea if this general approach should still work, or do we need to look at a > different method? > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 17:45:54 -0700 From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: Itanium Port Question Message-ID: <1188089154.990943.87340@r29g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Aug 24, 1:27 pm, Randy Park wrote: > I've been called in to help with a port to Itanium on some software that I was > the prime developer for many many years. I haven't touched a VMS system in > 4 years, plus I only worked part time on VMS for the previous 6 years. So here > goes. > > The application is a commerical tool sold into the VMS marketplace. It supports > many databases (Rdb, Oracle, etc.) plus RMS. All at the same time. But not all > customers have all databases, let alone even one database. In order to make > one set of images work for all customers we would go through the following > generalized build procedure: > > 1. Compile all source code > 2. Link executable images with all databases up and running. > 3. Shut down database A. > 4. Link again, and note all unresolved symbols. > 5. Create shareable image(s) with stub routines containing entry points from step 4. > 6. Redefine logicals relevant to database A to point to shareable image from stop 5 > 7. Run and test software with database A missing > 8. Repeat steps 3 through 7 for every database system. > > Notes: > 1. All databases used shareable images. > 2. During startup time, DCL procedures would look to see which databases were > present and define logicals to point to stub images for missing databases. > > This general build process would work for almost all databases on Vax and Alpha. > There were some strange things regarding CDD that I don't recall right now. > > The developers involved in the port are telling me that this general process no longer > works on Itanium. They're getting some kind of "ELF" error message. (I'm trying to > get the exact error message from them.) > > Any idea if this general approach should still work, or do we need to look at a > different method? > > -- > Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Randy, I have used precisely this type of procedure many times, most publicly in my recent OpenVMS Technical Journal article "Strategies for Migrating from Alpha and VAX systems to HP Integrity Servers on OpenVMS" (link at http://www.rlgsc.com/publications/vmstechjournal/migrationstrategies.html ). I have seen no direct problems. My first impression from this post is that one of the build procedures is doing something incorrectly. In my examples, I was able to use essentially the same build procedures and options files on Alpha and Itanium. I admit that I would have to look at precisely what you are doing to determine where the problem is. However, I CAN say that the general approach should work flawlessly. - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 17:50:52 -0700 From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: Itanium Port Question Message-ID: <1188089452.167903.238190@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com> To all my colleagues, For ease of following the dialogue, I suggest that all future postings go in the other thread of this topic at http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.vms/browse_thread/thread/28d0b3159f274263/782533b0318224cc#782533b0318224cc - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 15:44:18 -0700 From: FrankS Subject: Re: Itanium porting question Message-ID: <1188081858.286543.276250@50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com> On Aug 25, 3:54 pm, Randy Park wrote: > I was misusing the term "symbol resolution". And yes, the hack we were > performing was done simply to keep the image activator from complaining. > Maybe someone else will read this and tell me about a different hack. Without knowing how your applications are written it's a little difficult to come up with an alternative solution that won't require a lot of rewriting. Of course, given that the first solution wasn't too great then maybe it's time to bite the bullet and invest a little effort in getting it corrected. My suggestion would be to add a layer of abstraction above the database/RMS access routines. That is, create subroutines of your own that wrap the calls to the database products for attach, read, write, commit, etcetera. Name the subroutines uniquely so they match the database product name. For example, MYRDB$ATTACH, MYSYBASE $ATTACH, MYRMS$OPEN, etcetera. Put all of these wrapper routines into shareable images, one per database product. Each of those routines would mask the underlying database entry points (which appear to be changing on Integrity) and give you a constant, known set of names. Now, in addition to the working MYRDB$ATTACH, etcetera, create a stub version of them into a seperate shareable image. Again, one shareable set of stub routines per database product. You can ship all the database stubs and working wrappers. One single build. During installation use your existing methods to determine which database products are installed and define logical names to point to either a stub shareable or a working wrapper shareable. The image activator will always find your entry point names in whichever shareable the logicals reference. If it's the stub shareable then nothing else happens. If it's the working wrapper shareable then it, in turn, will reference the database-specific entry point names and the image activator will go out and resolve them. How does that sound? It's a lot like what you're doing now, except the abstraction layer hides the unknown entry points (database product specific). ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 17:48:42 -0700 From: Bob Gezelter Subject: Re: Itanium porting question Message-ID: <1188089322.217697.39540@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> On Aug 24, 8:30 pm, Randy Park wrote: > This is a second attempt to post this question. My news server sometimes > fails to post messages and I've waited 4 hours for it to appears. My apologies > if it shows up twice. > > I've been called in to help with a port to Itanium on some software that I was > the prime developer for many many years. I haven't touched a VMS system in > 4 years, plus I only worked part time on VMS for the previous 6 years. So here > goes. > > The application is a commerical tool sold into the VMS marketplace. It supports > many databases (Rdb, Oracle, etc.) plus RMS. All at the same time. But not all > customers have all databases, let alone even one database. In order to make > one set of images work for all customers we would go through the following > generalized build procedure: > > 1. Compile all source code > 2. Link executable images with all databases up and running. > 3. Shut down database A. > 4. Link again, and note all unresolved symbols. > 5. Create shareable image(s) with stub routines containing entry points from step 4. > 6. Redefine logicals relevant to database A to point to shareable image from stop 5 > 7. Run and test software with database A missing > 8. Repeat steps 3 through 7 for every database system. > 9. At this point we now have an executable that can run with or without various > databases being present. > > Notes: > 1. All databases used shareable images. > 2. During startup time, DCL procedures would look to see which databases were > present and define logicals to point to stub images for missing databases. > > This general build process would work for almost all databases on Vax and Alpha. > There were some strange things regarding CDD that I don't recall right now. > > The developers involved in the port are telling me that this general process no longer > works on Itanium. They're getting some kind of "ELF" error message. (I'm trying to > get the exact error message from them.) > > Any idea if this general approach should still work, or do we need to look at a > different method? > > -- > Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Randy, I have used precisely this type of procedure many times, most publicly in my recent OpenVMS Technical Journal article "Strategies for Migrating from Alpha and VAX systems to HP Integrity Servers on OpenVMS" (link at http://www.rlgsc.com/publications/vmstechjournal/migrationstrategies.... ). I have seen no direct problems. My first impression from this post is that one of the build procedures is doing something incorrectly. In my examples, I was able to use essentially the same build procedures and options files on Alpha and Itanium. I admit that I would have to look at precisely what you are doing to determine where the problem is. However, I CAN say that the general approach should work flawlessly. - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2007 12:57:31 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: Wisconsin professor says global warming a hoax! Message-ID: On 08/25/07 10:09, David J Dachtera wrote: [snip] > > I would opine that it may be possible to buffer the effects of a naturally > occuring phenomenon - "may": no guarantees - within the limits of our > technology. "Stopping" would be rather akin to adjusting the output of old Sol > out there, adjusting the orbit of Terra around it or Terra's rotation about its > axis, or otherwise attempting to modify the very nature of either the planet, > the solar system or the universe. http://www.gotfuturama.com/Information/Encyc-94-Global_Warming/ We could always drop giant ice cubes in the ocean! -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.467 ************************